well hello hello!

[Thunderbeast86]

Hi There guys (& possibly gals),

I'm interested in some of SI products, but have some questions...

My current set-up is as follows: (2) 12" old School Cerwin Vega Strokers in a big ported pox tuned to about 30hz. Powered by D.E.I. 2400d

I hit 147.6db at a shop in metro detroit. That's the only time i've had it metered, AND I had a hole in one of subs (due to the box for my eibach springs hit it).

I've never entered into competitions or anything like that, and I know it sounds cliche' but SQL is my goal, which is exactly why I went with the old school stroker. Everyone who reads this is probably saying "yeah, SQL my @$$ with such a big ported box" BUT, strokers have MINIMAL excursion, and without a linear motor like the XBL^2, most woofers that DO have a lot of excursion create a bunch of distortion.

Strokers HAVE won SQ competitions due to how little they move (and of course there are other reasons), and it's actually pretty crazy to see the woofer BARELY move and hit 147.6db.

So I guess what I'm asking is, what SI product would fit my taste? And honestly, how do they compare to Adire Brahma/RE XXX with the XBl^2 motor?

It's been quite a few years since I've checked out car audio. It took me 2 years to decide on getting Strokers, and when I got them, I stopped reading up on what's new and great. If that tells you anything about me, I make sure I'm going to like before I buy it.

Price isn't MUCH of an issue. Ideally, I'd like to keep the woofers under $1,000 for the pair.

And, I know it would be weird for members to suggest products OTHER than SI's, but if any of you feel there is a product out there that would better suit my needs than SI's, I greatly welcome the suggestions.

Are CV Strokers (old school ones) even popular anymore? In my opinion, I don't know why they wouldn't be! I don't think it's possible dollar for dollar, to beat the quality you get. Where else can you spend $200 for each woofer and hit 147.6db with a hole in one of them? haha I REALLY wish I would have had it metered before it got a hole in it, how much do you guys think it has an effect on SPL? Because honestly, I didn't even KNOW there was a hole in it til I SAW it, because I did NOT even notice a difference in sound quality.

Thanks for your time,
Brian
Detroit

P.S. - This is for my 97 Thunderbird with some go-fast goodies

P.S.S. - I don't have any sound deadening or anything like that. It's literally a custom built box by an Adire retailer, the subs, the amp, and a Clarion head unit.

[Electrodynamic]

Just because the drivers don't move a lot doesn't mean they're immune to non-linear BL and/or suspension distortion. If that were the case, PA bass drivers would rule the SQ lanes. The reason for your big ported box requirement is a direct result of the drivers parameters, and some of that is the reduced stroke and high efficiency (high BL, short coil, very light moving mass, tight suspension, etc).

It sounds like you're perfectly happy with your strokers, so what is your question? You didn't really outline any criteria about what you're looking for other than saying that you're happy with your strokers. Are you looking to reduce your box size? Do you still want to reach 147 dB no matter what? Do you care about weight at all? Are you looking for better sound quality? Worse sound quality but louder?

[Thunderbeast86]

I'm looking for and upgrade, that's it.

I've always wanted a sub with an XBL^2 motor.

One of my questions was: How do SI products compare to Adire Brahma and RE XXX?

A better question would be: What subs would have similar SPL, with better quality? Are there any out there? Keep in my mind the limit I'm hoping to spend.

One of my other questions was: How much affect do you think the hole in my stroker had on SPL/SQ?

Back when I was really into subs, the RE XXX and Adire Brahma were supposed to be "the best" SQ/SPL for anything under $1,000. Where is the industry at now?

[Electrodynamic]

From the sounds of it, you'd be better off with a XXX over anything else. You'll also reduce your enclosure volume a bit over the Strokers. The XXX has a much bigger voice coil and higher power handling, which is going to help you out in your SPL quest. The XXX is also an incredibly linear driver, which will help the SQ side of things.

The hole in your Stroker definitely didn't help. It depends on how big the hole was/is and where the hole was as to how much it robbed you in the SPL lanes.

[Electrodynamic]

PS: None of our products are up your alley. We focus on small sealed enclosure subwoofers only. Back in the day, our v3's would have been a great fit because they were more of a 60/40 (SPL/SQ) split. Now our Mag's are a 40/60 split, but the SQ improved a LOT with the v4's over the previous v3's.

...although four Mag v4's in 4 cubes would be pretty ridiculous.

[Subwoofery]

Originally Posted by Electrodynamic

PS: None of our products are up your alley. We focus on small sealed enclosure subwoofers only. Back in the day, our v3's would have been a great fit because they were more of a 60/40 (SPL/SQ) split. Now our Mag's are a 40/60 split, but the SQ improved a LOT with the v4's over the previous v3's.

...although four Mag v4's in 4 cubes would be pretty ridiculous.

I was about to suggest 4 Mags too

SQ will be (I think that I won't get flamed for it) BETTER than your previous strokers...

Kelvin

[Thunderbeast86]

The hole was about one inch in diameter, and about 2-3 inches from the center of the cone (about an inch down from the spider on the cone). ANY guesstimate at all?

I've heard some things about Fi, what's the story with them?

So out of every sub out there, you say the RE XXX best fits?


what is the RMS handling on the XXX? I thought it was in the 1,000 - 1,500 rms, like my stoker? I looked on their website and all it says is "power thermal rating 2,000 watts", not sure if that means peak or rms?

What happened to Adire? They're going out of business/trying to find a buyer?

OH, and most importantly- I know it's hard for you to say, but you're confident that replacing my system with 2 Re XXX's would be a definite improvement over the Stroker in both categories?

P.S. - I hoping I'm not bugging you guys. I stumbled upon your website and thought it was pretty effin sweet you make your own subs. So I figured you would be quite knowledgeable, and was hoping SI had a product for me. I'd much rather support an entrepreneur!

[Electrodynamic]

Four Mag v4's would still be freakin awesome. Ultra-low distortion and LOTS of output.

Anyway, Adire is out of business. 'been that way for quite a few years really. The XXX specs you're looking at are the new XXX specs. The new XXX drivers are monsters compared to the older (2005'ish) models. I was actually referring to the 2005'ish models that were built by Destijl and had XBL^2 motors on them. Like the one's that were for sale in this thread: RE Audio , Hyrbid Audio, JL Audio - NIB - CARSOUND.COM Forum You can see how much different they are compared to the new XXX.

Before I forget, thermal power handling is how much the coil can take before it goes poof. Basically any time you see any definitions of power handling, such as thermal or mechanical, they all mean that's the power limit at which they break in some way shape or form.

Honestly, if you like your Strokers that much, search for a good Stroker and replace the one that has the hole in it. You probably lost ~2dB due to the hole in the one driver.

[CrazyKenKid]

How about TC audio? i hear they have some good subs as for Fi my buddy has a 15 and it slams but i prefer the 15mag that si makes over the fi any day! actualy check this out

15" STERO INTEGRITY MAG D2 - (eBay.ca item 140310956258 end time 05-Apr-09 14:13:48 EDT)

pretty good deal for a loud ass sub man! i heard ppl getting like 151 db plus out of these subs so jsut think what 2 of them can do! lol!

[Thunderbeast86]

Originally Posted by Electrodynamic

Honestly, if you like your Strokers that much, search for a good Stroker and replace the one that has the hole in it. You probably lost ~2dB due to the hole in the one driver.

The thing is, the REASON I like them so much, is because the only systems I've heard are the typical brands you can buy at Best Buy and Mickey Shorr (audio shop owned by ABC warehouse). Compared to Rockford Fosgates (all kinds), MTX 9500's, MTX 8000's (my old system), etc. etc. the strokers are UNBELIEVABLY superior.

I've never had the opportunity to hear Adire, RE, Fi, SI, etc, IN PERSON.

So yeah, I love my strokers, but that's because I've never been able to hear REAL car audio subs in person.

This kid I know has literally gone through 6 different systems trying to "beat" my strokers. I know, very childish. In fact, he was the one who installed my system in his car, drove 45min to the audio shop, and PAID to have it metered, just so he could know if his system was louder. The last system he bought, which he FOR SURE thought was going to blow me out of the water, was 2 15" 9500's in that MTX sledgehammer box.

He was lucky to hit 140. And my system was 10x cleaner sounding.

So once that happened, I was REALLY impressed with my stroker. BUT, that isn't saying much. I've still never heard the "underground" brands (compared to what most kids have these days).

Just to make sure we're on the same page, you suggested that the Older RE XXX's are the ones I would like?
I'm guessing the newer ones are more SPL than the older ones?

Plus, the new XXX's have a hefty price tag on 'em.


Honestly, what do you think 4 (12)" mags would hit on the meter?
Since they are meant for sealed applications, and don't require MUCH space, I could probably fit 4 of those as easily as 2 XXX's that require over 2ft each.

P.S. - what is the RMS handling on the older XXX's? Wasn't it like 1,500w or something? I remember it being pretty high, at least AS high as my strokers.